Author Topic: csv125-50-1  (Read 128 times)

TKB4

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csv125-50-1
« on: June 12, 2019, 06:35:59 AM »
I have a 10sq07 3/4 HP pump. I installed the CSV125 50 psi model when I installed the pump last year.  It functioned as it should to keep the pressure at 50 psi.  Recently I noticed some air in the system. I found a small leak under the house where pipe went into a slab that probably settled and was draining out a french drain system.   I cut off flow to the house inside the house thus stopping the flow to the leak and the gauge showed dropping pressure and still cycled .  I then went to the outside cutoff near the well and shut it off and the pressure still dropped and well cycled. So I apparently had two leaks Probably the one under house for a while and just couldn't see it. There was also a leak somewhere from pump to to tank to cutoff where line goes to the house.

I thought that there may be a bad check valve in the pump or a leak in the PVC downpipe.  I could hear what sounded like water running back down the well when pump cycled off.  I wanted to replace the brittle PVC pipe that broke in two places when removing it last year but didn't have time to wait on delivery of Polyethylene downpipes so repaired the pvc and reinstalled .  So I ordered the polyethylene pipe and barb adapters, nipple and al check valve with Vitron seal all in stainless.

This past weekend I pulled the pump and put check valve at the pump and replaced the pump in well with the new poly down pipe. Even though I did not find a specific leak the downpipes was not totally full of water.  After replacing the pump back into well I ran the water to clear any possible debris and saw none. I then lowered the spool valve rest of the way and repowered the system and ran water a while in house and noticed even after clearing the air out the pressure was fluctuating.  I then went back outside and cut off water to house at the well and the system stayed pressurized from pump to house cutoff.  It also stayed pressurized from  pump to cutoff inside the house.  Of course there was still a small leak under the house.   

The problem is now the pump continuously cycles and there is only a 4 gallon tank and I have a watersource pump and dump.  .  I emptied tank and checked pressure it was 38 psi.  The pressure switch is set at 40 to 60.  The CSV125 is 5o psi though our gauge showed 48 psi before the replacement. 

So the CSV125 functioned normally then I put in check valve at pump and replaced downpipes and now it doesn't function none of the other piping was disturbed..  Once I think the valve started working because I started hearing water go through it. 

Does adding the check valve at pump cause a problem?    I haven't fixed the under house leak yet but the valve was functioning with that present.  The gauge also seems to drop further after pump starts and fluctuate a bit at first then builds up normally.  I had not noticed this before but I attributed it to the soft start of the SQ pump.

In retrospect I don't know for sure that check valve in pump was functional or not it looked ok.  I didn't see a leak in downpipe but I don't think it was full of water.  There was a loss in pressure in the well system and now there is not.  The leak under house is still present but it was also present when CSV was functioning. I also noted that there is somewhat of a check valve in the spool valve that might be functional but doesn't appear very reliable just a weak spring and rubber seal screwed on not in a pipe etc.

Could this be related to adding the check valve at the pump and if it is wouldn't the pressures just cycle a little then CSV start working?

Maybe air in CSV?   Any suggestions or insight would be appreciated.

Cary Austin

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2019, 06:58:24 AM »
The 4 gallon tank only holds 1 gallon of water.  You can tell how big the leak is by how long it takes to use that gallon of water when the pump comes back on.  The leak may also be where the air is getting in.  You either need to fix the leak or figure out how large a tank is needed to keep the pump from cycling more than once per hour or so.  That big of a leak is probably going to cause other problems as well.

And yes it sounds like the check valve on the pump was not working and now it is.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2019, 08:00:45 AM »
so why isn't the csv working now a leak is same as a faucet in house open? 

Cary Austin

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2019, 10:05:19 AM »
If the leak is before the CSV or is less than 1 GPM after the CSV, the pump will still cycle.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2019, 09:28:36 AM »
For clarification the leak is at the house well down flow from the CSV.

To clarify:  If both check valves, the one in the pump and the one I added at the pump were functional could that keep the CSV from functioning normally?

Cary Austin

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #5 on: June 13, 2019, 10:22:28 AM »
The check valves should have nothing to do with it unless they are broken and stopping up the flow completely.  Less than 1 GPM leak after the CSV will cause the pump to cycle, but it should be a very slow cycle.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #6 on: June 13, 2019, 04:14:12 PM »
I just rechecked and there are no leaks between house and well, tank etc.  The leak is about 1.5 gallons per minute.  The cycle stop valve does not function at all flow rates from 1 gallon to above 10 gallons per minute.  Here is a link to a photo of my setup :

https://imgur.com/PaBM2Dl

Can the CSV be separated at the orange band without damage in order to remove it and possibly replace  or do I need to cut the pipe and place a union there?   Or do you have any other suggestions other than replacing the CSV valve ?

Cary Austin

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2019, 07:29:41 PM »
No you can't take the CSV125 apart.  I still don't understand the problem.  If the pump is cycling when no water is being used, there is a leak somewhere.  If the pump is cycling when more than 1 GPM is being used, the pressure switch could be set too low, or the CSV is not working.  Make sure your gauge is good and the pressure switch is at least 40/60.  The noise you are hearing in the CSV is either the valve working or could be something stuck in it.  Sometimes things get loose when working on the pipes and it ends up in the CSV.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2019, 10:16:35 PM »
https://i.imgur.com/PaBM2Dl.jpg  This is a link to photo of setup if it works.  I plan to cut pipe to remove valve and put in a union. Hopefully will find  some trash that is removable.  Also plan to address the leak under house tommorrow. At least I have a soft start pump.  Thanks for the help.

Cary Austin

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #9 on: June 14, 2019, 07:05:02 AM »
Still can't see the link. Maybe you could email the picture?  I'll bet you find something in the CSV.  The soft start thing really doesn't help much on submersibles, you really need to fix the leak.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #10 on: June 14, 2019, 09:02:56 AM »
Yes I should be able to.

TKB4

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Re: csv125-50-1
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2019, 10:43:14 AM »
I have at least partially resolved my problems
The Cycle Stop Valve was functioning as it should!
My pressure gauge was wrong.  When I replaced it and then readjusted the pressure switch the Cycle Stop Valve functioned as it should.

I also believe I found the source of the original leak in the well.  After I got the valve working again and used the water normally for about a day the pressure in the house dropped and when I checked the well I could hear water running in it again.  The only thing that had changed was increasing the pressure switch from what turned out to be 30psi to 50psi to the desired 40psi to 60 psi.  I determined that at least now it is the o rings on the spool valve that are leaking.  I plan to replace them tomorrow and see how it does, but now I wonder if the o rings even new ones will allow 60psi or higher since they seemed to withstand the 40 psi for years.