Pressure reducing valve

[japgar07]

Hello all,

Total newbie here, but I had a plummer stop by to take a look at my water heater.  During the service I asked him if he knew about cycle stop valve technology.  He had no clue about it, but when I showed him the website and some pics of the valve itself he said, "oh yeah that's a pressure reducing valve".  "I install those all the time."  He then said it would not benefit my setup and would actually hurt my pump because it would be working against a constant back pressure which would reduce the life of the pump.  He said that my current setup, a 33gal pc133 challenger recently installed, was all I need.  My impression from him was that a standard well setup like mine was not as severe as a constant 50 psi pressure reduction and that the CSV would actually hurt my pump.

Personally, I would really like to have constant pressure pump/CSV, however I don't want to reduce the life of the pump, which is contradictory to one of CSV benefits.  I also don't want to install it myself and would like someone with experience to do, but I am starting to get the impression most contractors around here (NW Ohio) have no clue what it is. 

I searched the main page to look for explanations as to why a CSV is not a PRV and why that claim has to be false, as you would have a lot of unhappy users claiming their pumps are failing prematurely. Can someone provide some literature regarding this issue? 

Also, does anyone know of anyone in my area that knows how to install the CSV? 

Thanks,

[Cary Austin]

Well a CSV does work similar to a PRV, except that it is made to maintain cooling flow to the pump at all times.  But you are right, "he had no clue" what he was talking about.  The backpressure from a CSV is actually good for a pump.  The CSV reduces the amp draw and makes the motor run cooler and last longer.

A 33 gallon pressure tank only holds 8 gallons of water.  What is hard on the pump is cycling on/off for every 8 gallons used.  Running continuously as when using a CSV is good for the pump.  Pumps are made for and like "continuous duty", it is the cycling on and off that destroys them.

Contractors are being kept in the dark about this by their suppliers and manufacturers, as they see the CSV as a "disruptive product".  The CSV is disruptive to their business because it is inexpensive, makes pumps last longer, uses smaller and less expensive tanks, and replaces expensive and short lived variable speed controllers and pumps.  The CSV will save you a LOT of money, which is why they don't want you to know about it.  The CSV will also deliver a stronger constant pressure to the house, so it is a win, win situation for you, as much as it is a lose, lose situation for installers and suppliers.

It is just a simple valve.  Any plumber can install it.  They just need to keep their mouths shut about things they do not understand and simply get the job done.  Once they see how it works, you can usually see the light bulb above their head light up.  But only on the ones with enough intelligence to know what they are looking at, which is unfortunately very rare these days.

The CSV is not a new product.  We have been doing this since 1993.  And as you said there would be a lot of unhappy customers if their pumps were failing prematurely.  If you read our reviews and references you will see that just the opposite is happening, all those pumps are lasting much longer.  The real accelerated tests are the ones where people say they never had a pump last longer than 2-3 years.  Yet after adding a CSV those pumps have now lasted 15-20 years and are still working.  From this you can see that the CSV actually increases the life of the pump 5 to 10 times longer than normal.  Is it any wonder than someone who makes their living selling pumps and tanks would try their best to talk you out of a CSV?

[illrohan]

Could someone elaborate on this continuous "cooling flow" please? That seams to be the key difference from the csv & a reg prv.

[Cary Austin]

Yes that is the main difference.  The CSV just cannot completely close like a PRV.  Even in the closed position the smaller CSV's will still allow about 1 GPM to pass, which is enough to keep the motor cool.  If you are using more than 1 GPM the CSV keeps the pump running continuously.  If you are not using any water, the 1 GPM coming through the CSV has no place to go except the pressure tank, which is then filled until the pressure switch shuts off the pump.

We started out just drilling a hole through a PRV.  We soon learned a hole will clog just like the holes in a shower head, which burns up the pump.  So the seat of the CSV is specially designed to close down to 1 GPM minimum.  This bypass is self flushing to prevent clogging.  The size and placement of the bypass is important as too much flow causes cycling, and too little burns up the pump.

This type bypass also allows us to increase valve reaction speed.  This is needed to allow the CSV to keep up with quick changes in demands.  Increased reaction speed in a PRV would cause a pulsation or bouncing of the pressure.

[Shrimped]

Thanks Cary that was really helpful.